Dan: Do you think that, I'm trying to think of a way to phrase this without loading it, because it's easy to be politically correct, and we can talk about how unfair the performance world is to women, and I'm not saying it's not, but I want to figure out a way to actually, intelligently vivisect that and look at the beating heart of what's happening. Erin and I were talking about this: women, without even knowing that we're doing it, women, unlike men, who just...men, it doesn't matter if we're handsome, doesn't matter if we're ugly, doesn't matter what we are, doesn't matter what role we occupy, doesn't matter if we have a bad back, doesn't matter if one of our legs doesn't work, it doesn't matter. Our role in the world is to kind of, want, and like, shoot out torpedoes, and try and either fail or succeed, and I think that women on stage, when women are performing in anything, no matter how enlightened the venue, no matter what the case...it's like there's a fucking tightrope you have to walk as a woman because the most progressive, PC, super modern, metrosexual, futuristic Blade Runner-thinker is still, before he's even thinking of it, he's thinking of a woman as a woman and there's, the way Erin put it is something like: if you're THIS they're disappointed in you, if you're THAT they're disappointed in you, the only way to describe it is a tightrope, and I don't know what it's a tightrope between, really, but it's like you're doing some kind of balancing act all the time.
Fedora: Well, I feel like you addressed that with Genevieve last week, when you were talking abut her reception on the reality show she was on, about something Kevin Smith said to her about "Oh, you're a girl and you like comic books."
Dan: I mean, that was insane to me. I don't want to give myself some kind of Alan Alda medal. My thing is always, like, the same way with alcoholism or racism, I want to cut everyone off at the pass and go, "Fuck, I'm a misogynist, I'm a sexist," and here's why: because I don't want to have that conversation where it's like, "Are you or aren't you all this bullshit?" And I think the thing that gets me in the most trouble is that I think... why am I talking about myself with this? Because I don't want to sound like I'm on a soapbox, I don't want to rush to judge, but I thought in that moment that was a very odd thing that happened, where she actually got the better of this guy in this debate, and in the edited context of this thing, the first thing he said is, "Gotta give props to a chick who can correct a dude on Frank Miller." It's like, holy shit, we're nerds, we're down at the bottom of this valley, and there's still, down here where Gollum lives, male Gollums are still going, "Props to that pussy man! That pussy was good at knowing which fish to eat raw!" It's like, what? We're all Gollum down here. That was really weird to me. [...] I pontificate all the time about race, and it's much easier to obsess about race than it is about gender, for me anyway, I think because of the relationship I have with my mom, because women: sometimes you want to have sex with them, sometimes you don't, in between there's 8,000,050 things. There are women who, like, you can objectify them without knowing that you're objectifying them, and then even if you can get through that hurdle, then everyone else's weird objectifications of women come into play. So if you were a guy and you respected a woman that you worked with, and you were like, "Oh, she's really funny, I really like her, I want her to be my friend," it's like, then on the other side of that, there's all this like, it's crazy! Is that a problem that we solve or do we accept that that's the case?
Fedora: I think it's something that we always keep in mind and strive to understand, and hopefully change sometime.
Dan: ...Yeah, I don't know, it's a weird epiphany to have at 40, where it's like I'm not going to be able to do anything about it anyway.
Fedora: That's not true, because you had a lady on the show and you talked about how, as a lady nerd, she got talked down to by Kevin Smith, who I would love to admire and respect as an artist, but then says shit like that.
Dan: I mean, off the cuff though, he doesn't even know he's saying it. [...] I mean, if he did come out right now, bro down with the cho down, like whatever, we're not going to be like, "We brought you out here to take you to task!"
Jeff: Let's not bring him out.
Fedora: I even feel like that's a conversation he'd be willing to have, about like, "Oh, yeah, so I didn't really...", like, he'd continue this conversation with us, rather than just try to defend himself.
Dan: I don't know, speaking as someone who's been on Twitter, and had people tweet at me being like, "Uh, point of honor, episode 3 of season 2, so-and-so made this joke-" and it's like: you can't help but like, the definition of your humanity, you have a certain amount of loaded guns out there, otherwise, who are you? If everything that comes your way, you're like, "Oh, I see your side immediately!", you can't help but go, "Okay, first of all, why is this person full of shit." I'm just speaking to that hypothetically, like, "Let's have Kevin Smith on and talk about gender and that one comment he made on that reality show!"
Fedora: Well, I'm not suggesting that's something you should actually do, what I was saying is that I don't think he's that guy all the time, at his core, I know he's not a misogynist.
Dan: I would go so far as to say I don't think ANYONE is that guy. I think that ANY of us from ANY perspective at any given time, we could accidentally [be that guy].
Fedora: [...] That's all I had to say, I just wanted to say I'm glad that you had a lady on the show, and that made me happy.
Dan: She was swell, and you know, that was Erin. Erin found that show, and Erin identified with Genevieve, and the Erin tweeted Genevieve, that was all Erin. And Erin comes up here and takes a punch to the ovaries every week and walks that tightrope for all women. And she has her own podcast, This Feels Terrible, where she talks about relationships, and I live with her, so I know that she'll get an email from somebody going, "Uh, regarding your interview with so-and-so, I think you did a huge disservice to blah blah blah when you said blah blah blah," and she'll get all wound up about it, the same way I would. It's like, half the people are calling you liberated for saying something, and then the other half of people are going "You just fucking Uncle Tom'd all women!" It's pretty complicated, and thank god for my little wiener.